Solved Replacing HDD - Need Plan and Backup Plan plus software

[whs]

I think the free Paragon can do differentials (incrementals too but that's no good). Check it.

 

[AndyTampa]

I think the free Paragon can do differentials (incrementals too but that's no good). Check it.

But Fiery said:

I can tell you which imaging software to stay away frrom ............ Paragon.

I don't think Paragon does imaging. It will do cloning if I pay for it. It doesn't restore to different hardware, but I'm not sure that affects what I'm trying to do. I want to store backups and backup images onto a different hard drive. Is that the same thing as "different hardware"?

It looks okay, but Fiery didn't explain why to stay away from it. Still, I need to do images and backups.

 

[whs]

I think Fiery does not know what he/she is talking about. Paragon is a top imaging program from a reputable company. I use mostly Macrium ( because it is easier to use than Paragon), but I never had problems with Paragon.

As an alternative you can use the Macrium Pro version. Look for sales.

 

[Fiery]

But Fiery said:

I don't think Paragon does imaging. It will do cloning if I pay for it. It doesn't restore to different hardware, but I'm not sure that affects what I'm trying to do. I want to store backups and backup images onto a different hard drive. Is that the same thing as "different hardware"?

It looks okay, but Fiery didn't explain why to stay away from it. Still, I need to do images and backups.

There (Paragon) tech support are all but useless, the forum they have is worse still. Yes they do Imaging, and cloning, but if you run into trouble you are on your own. I have a fully licensed version of there software. I see you are running Vista like I am. Which means you will need to create your own WinPE Recovery Media. And if like me you have a USB External Drive where you keep your images. The WinPE recovery media which is supposed to read USB drives, just doesn't.

I now also have Macrium Reflect Pro (the Pro version allows disk cloning), and there Recovery Media actually works, i.e. it reads all USB External Drives. Also Macrium tech support respond to an email within the next working day, unlike Paragon, who are not only very slow to respond, but in my opinion treat you like an idiot, and are passive aggressive (both tech support and there forums). When I ran into a problem recently trying to recover an image, on the advice of one the tech support people I paid for an upgrade to HDM 12 (Hard Disk Manager), which doesn't work with Vista ( the Recovery Boot Media ), I asked for a refund, it was given, but, this a paste from them :-

Dear Susan, you've got your money back and the license was given back, too. You're not allowed to use the WinPE recovery media. You're violating our license terms.

To which my response was :-

For HDM 12 yes but I still have a legal license for HDM 11

No comment was made by them.

So I say again stay away from Paragon, more so If you are not going to get a license, you will get nothing but grief.

That's my two cents worth

 

[Fiery]

I think Fiery does not know what he/she is talking about. Paragon is a top imaging program from a reputable company. I use mostly Macrium ( because it is easier to use than Paragon), but I never had problems with Paragon.

As an alternative you can use the Macrium Pro version. Look for sales.

Fiery is a she dear , and hate to burst your bubble, but she does know what she is talking about, having had first hand experience with Paragon.

I may not be a Guru, but please do not insult my intelligence.

 

[SIW2]

Sorry to hear about that Fiery.

Seems ok to me. If they refunded you for v12 - clearly you cannot keep using it.

If you have a licensed 11 - then of course you can use that.

Not sure what you mean about winpe.

I am using Paragon HDM12 PRO - there is a separate program with paid versions that makes pe media.

Rmb ( Recovery media builder ) uses the files already on win7/8 to make the pe media

Vista does not have the required files, so it needs a download from MS. Therefore for Vista users need to get the Bmb ( Boot media builder ) from their Paragon account .

Bmb works with the download from MS - it has to be done like that on Vista.

Third parties are no longer licensed by MS to ship pre made winpe.

Neither the MS Vista winpe or the MS win7 winpe supports usb3 natively. You would need to add drivers. That is the way it comes from MS.

 

[Fiery]

Sorry to hear about that Fiery.

Seems ok to me. If they refunded you for v12 - clearly you cannot keep using it.

If you have a licensed 11 - then of course you can use that.

Not sure what you mean about winpe.

I am using Paragon HDM12 PRO - there is a separate program with paid versions that makes pe media.

Rmb ( Recovery media builder ) uses the files already on win7/8 to make the pe media

Vista does not have the required files, so it needs a download from MS. Therefore for Vista users need to get the Bmb ( Boot media builder ) from their Paragon account .

Bmb works with the download from MS - it has to be done like that on Vista.

Third parties are no longer licensed by MS to ship pre made winpe.

Neither the MS Vista winpe or the MS win7 winpe supports usb3 natively. You would need to add drivers. That is the way it comes from MS.

Paragon's HDM12 has the WinPE Recovery Boot Media inbuilt into it, the only drawback is you must be running Win7 in order to use it.

With WinPE you can start from different kinds of media, including CDs, DVDs, USB flash devices (UFD), and Windows Deployment Services (Windows DS).

If you are like me and keep your backup images on an USB External Drive you need WinPE to recognise the USB External Drive.

The latest version of Macrium Reflect still give the user a reliable way to create the RBM, they are still incorporating the WinPE environment in there app, and what's more it works! When I use Macrium's RBM I see all of my External Drives, where as Paragon throws me an I/O device error if I have my External Drive plugged in.

Paragon would be okay if you only backed up to an Internal Drive. Me I am paranoid about losing things, in total I have 4 External Drives, 3 of which are attached to my PC and 1 is in my fireproof safe.

 

[AndyTampa]

Thanks for helping folks, but I'm afraid I'm even more confused now. Fiery seems to have the best answers for my computer, but all this talk of HDM 11 12 winpe etc. has be confused.

I need a solution that I can use on both computers, 1 XP and 1 Vista. I can't afford to buy the software twice and my networking skills are seriously lacking.

 

[SIW2]

You shouldn't need to buy anuthing.

There are great free solutions available.

I have used this and it is excellent:

Local download

Download free backup restore software ? AOMEI Backupper Freeware.

 

[AndyTampa]

I've stepped away from this for so long that I forgot everything I thought I knew. I think I just got too confused. If someone could assist with a plan, I'd appreciate it. All the terminology is getting me dizzy. Below, I've outlined my equipment and what I plan to do followed by some question that I hope are fairly easy to answer. Based on those answers, I think I'll have an easier time searching for software to use.

EQUIPMENT
----------------
1 Windows Vista computer with 2 HDD (4 partitions)
HDD 1 contains Partition B: (100 GB, 64.6 GB free), Partition C: (350 GB, 95.1 GB free), and Partition D: (15.19 GB, 6.89 GB free) [This drive contains the O/S, but its controller board has failed once and been replaced.]
HDD 2 contains Partition E: (152 GB, 71.9 GB free)
----------------
1 Windows XP computer with 2 HDD (2 partitions)
HDD 1 contains Partition C: (148 GB, 102 GB free and 10 GB unallocated)
HDD 2 contains Partition D: (18.6 GB, 18.5 GB free)
----------------
1 2-TB External Hard Drive
1 New 1.5-TB Internal HDD
NO VISTA Install Disk.

I am going to replace the Vista HDD1 with the New 1.5TB HDD and replace the Vista HDD2 with the current HDD1.
I'm going to use the Vista HDD2 to replace one of the disks in the XP machine. It depends on which disk is the one whistling every so often. I haven't determined which one.

PARTIAL PLAN
----------------
The external drive is plugged into the Vista machine via Firewire. I've shared files between the two computers, so I'm pretty sure I can share the disk drive or just an entire partition. What I've got for my plan so far is:

1) Partition the external drive so that the space used by the XP backups = 300 GB and the remainder will be used by the Vista backups.
2) Perform a complete image of all partitions of the Vista machine.
3) Install the New 1.5-TB HDD into the Vista machine as the boot drive.
4) Use the backup to image the New 1.5-TB HDD.
5) Erase the former O/S drive and re-image as the E: drive.
6) Perform the above steps on the XP machine. Exact steps will depend on which drive gets replaced.

QUESTIONS
----------------
I'm confused about what to look for in software. In my plan, it appears I need to get software that will create an image of my drives.
1) Is imaging the same thing as cloning?
2) Do I image the entire drive or each partition individually?
3) My current space on the Vista machine is 650 GB. Once I replace the drive, it will be 2 TB. Can the image be used to go back to a larger drive than the image?
4) What becomes of the extra space not used by the image?

After replacing and imaging drives, I'll need to perform regular backups.
1) What is the difference between and which is better/easier to use, incremental or differential backups?
2) Can I perform the same things outlined above with backup software instead of imaging software or will I need both?
3) I don't have a plan for doing backups. Can anyone suggest a plan that works to perform the occasional full backup or image and more frequent incremental/differential backups?

In step 4 of my plan above, will it be possible to get the image from an external disk to the new O/S disk without having the O/S or the drivers installed?

Does anyone see a problem with my plan?

 

[wither 3]

Before you even start, how can you have a hdd that has a OS but no partition for it?

 

[AndyTampa]

Before you even start, how can you have a hdd that has a OS but no partition for it?

I don't understand why you would ask that. Operating Systems are on Partition C: as usual. I don't think I inferred any differently. Did I say drive instead of disk improperly? Please explain your question.

 

[wither 3]

OOPs! I missed the reference to the C: drive.

 

[AndyTampa]

No problem! Do you have a plan or tips?

 

[Fiery]

Macrium Reflect Backup and Hard Disk Imaging for Windows 7, Vista, XP and Server 2003/2008
ReDeploy a system to new hardware
N.B REDEPLOY WILL ONLY WORK WITH THE PROFESSIONAL AND SERVER EDITIONS

 

[AndyTampa]

N.B REDEPLOY WILL ONLY WORK WITH THE PROFESSIONAL AND SERVER EDITIONS

Fiery, I don't know what that means. If it means I have to buy the software, then I can't afford it. I'm going to look into the free softwares, but I don't know what I'm actually looking to do with the software. I don't have a plan of attack and need a plan.

Ex: Am I looking for software for cloning or imaging or backups or more than one of those? Should I be looking for incremental or differential backups? Should I image and restore? Should I backup, reformat, and restore?

If I were baking a cake, I'd need ingredients and a recipe. The same applies here. I don't know what to do, in what order, or what to use.

 

[wither 3]

I don't have a backup plan for you but I thought I would try to explain the differences between file backup types.

1. Incremental- The first backup is a full backup. The second backup is a backup of changed files in the first backup. The third backup is a backup of changed files in the second backup. In other words, each backup includes changed files in the last backup. This results in lots of small backups. All though it takes less space, it takes longer to do the restore because it has to restore all those small backups.

2. Differential- the first backup is a full backup. The second backup is a backup of changed files in the first backup. The third backup is a backup of changed files in the first backup. Each subsequent backup includes changed files from the first backup. This requires more space than the incremental backup. However, it takes less time to restore since only the first and last backups have to be restored.

3. Update- The first backup is a full backup. The second backup is all changed files in the first backup. The third backup is all changed files in the first backup, however, it overwrites the second backup. As a result it takes far less space than the other types.

The nice thing about an incremental backup is that you can restore any of the individual backups. You don't have to restore the whole backup to get files that you might want from a particular point in time.

Some software can even restore individual files from these types of backups. However, those programs are usually not free. You get what you pay for.

 

[AndyTampa]

I don't have a backup plan for you but I thought I would try to explain the differences between file backup types.

1. Incremental- The first backup is a full backup. The second backup is a backup of changed files in the first backup. The third backup is a backup of changed files in the second backup. In other words, each backup includes changed files in the last backup. This results in lots of small backups. All though it takes less space, it takes longer to do the restore because it has to restore all those small backups.

2. Differential- the first backup is a full backup. The second backup is a backup of changed files in the first backup. The third backup is a backup of changed files in the first backup. Each subsequent backup includes changed files from the first backup. This requires more space than the incremental backup. However, it takes less time to restore since only the first and last backups have to be restored.

3. Update- The first backup is a full backup. The second backup is all changed files in the first backup. The third backup is all changed files in the first backup, however, it overwrites the second backup. As a result it takes far less space than the other types.

The nice thing about an incremental backup is that you can restore any of the individual backups. You don't have to restore the whole backup to get files that you might want from a particular point in time.

Some software can even restore individual files from these types of backups. However, those programs are usually not free. You get what you pay for.

That's good information Wither. Thank you. From what I can gather, number 3 (Update) is the better of the three types with number 2 (differential) being a close second. The only difference is that I'd have to manually delete intermediate differential backups to preserve space. The only benefit to number 1 (incremental) is the ability to restore individual files from the backups.

I haven't found a software yet that does what number 3 does, but I'm not done looking. I'm flummoxed that of all the people in this forum, nobody has a backup plan that they can share. I've never done backups because I don't know how and I had no idea it would be so hard to get help doing it. Maybe I'm adding a layer of complexity to it by changing out hard drives.

I have to have the hard drives backed up before switching them out, but I need to be able to restore my drives after the switch. Am I making this too difficult? If I mess up, I'll lose stuff I can't replace, so I'm trying to get a "recipe" and idiotproof myself. Do you have any suggestions on where I can find all the information I need to do what I need done?

 

[wither 3]

Nero versions 12 and earlier do an update backup. However, v12 and earlier are no longer sold by Nero but are probably available for sale on the web. The trick is to find a copy whose serial number has never been used. You can only use a serial number on one computer. Nero Backitup 2014 is free but to get automatic backups, you need to pay a minimum of 1.99 US a month because it provides cloud backup. There are probably other products out there that do the same thing.

I need to think about your backup plan.

 

[AndyTampa]

On this page, HOWTO: Clone Your Hard Drive, the author suggests doing both imaging and incremental backups. However, he says cloning is also called imaging. His suggested software Macrium Reflect (free) claims it does both cloning and imaging. This is how I get confused.

The author says cloning and imaging are the same, yet the software he recommends says otherwise. What is the difference? Also, the paid version of the software he recommends does differential and incremental backups. So is Macrium Reflect backup software or imaging software? Then I'd have to choose the Pro version to restore to dissimilar hardware. Does that mean the free version won't let me switch the hard disks like I want?