Solved Annoying 'Boot Loop' issue - advice needed

Oskari · Aug 4, 2008

Hi folks,

This is my first post and I'm glad I found a community of Vista x64 people.

Anyway...

I recently purchased a new machine and it suffers from a slightly annoying problem whenever I start it. It seems to run through OK and then decides to do what I call a 'boot loop'. It goes through the 'normal' Dos-like screens, does a blue-screen 'chkdsk' thingy (says that windows was shut-down incorrectly - which it wasn't) and then asks if I want to start in one of the tasty flavours of 'safe mode'. Now, I've been to safe-mode, being the submissive I can be, but that accomplishes nothing, except the grace of a computer stuck in the Middle Ages. Anyway, I decide to start Windows as 'normal' and it goes on this 'boot loop'. The good news is that it usually (90%+) makes it to the desktop and the system sings sweetly thereafter.

My concern is that there is a little gremlin stuck somewhere in my system and I want to find a way to exorcise the beast. Note: I can provide more specific 'screen' data if needed, i.e. taking a photo of the offending screens.

My system:

Intel Core 2 Quad 6600
Gigabyte EP45-DS3 mobo
8 Gb Corsair 6400-C5 RAM (4xTwin2X4096)
640 Gb WD Sata II HD
Sapphire HD4850 512Mb PCIE DDR3 GPU
Logitech MX514 mouse
Logitech speakers
22" Samsung 2232BW LCD monitor
Windows Vista Home Premium x64
(All drivers seem up-to-date)

BTW, I was a Vista detractor for so long I feel embarrassed. I'm really enjoying my new computer experience...except for the above mentioned one!

kruger · Aug 4, 2008

Possibly a bad driver or program which is starting up with windows causing your blue screen and reboot.

When your in safe mode, try going through with msconfig and see what might be starting up and causing your system to loop, check startup folder, run folders in registry. Basically just look for anything unusual starting up.

You can use something easier like X-Ray pc or hijackthis and remove any unusual items that are starting up.

Do you remember the last thing you may have installed or updated right before your problem started?

johngalt · Aug 5, 2008

It's not a Blue Screen - CHKDSK runs ina blue screen as well, and the OP even said CHKDSK.

Hi, Oskari, and welcome to the forums.

If your machine is constantly trying to run chkdsk, then something is amiss - first and foremost, I'd take it back and get an exchange for a different machine, as itis so new there really should not be this sort of issue at all....

kruger · Aug 5, 2008

Funny how our eyes can glance over words when we are reading fast. Didn't see the chkdsk part.

Anyway, I suppose you can just re-image the machine and see if that works. Its definitely possible to have a bad image from the factory. I would be more inclined to run a HHD utility or better yet check all the hardware and make sure everything is OK and the drive isn't bad, then re-image it, just to be sure all is well.

How long have you had the unit? Is it like this out of the box?

Oskari · Aug 6, 2008

Thanks for the responses. It surely is getting annoying. The system seems to work perfectly except for this 'boot loop' problem (today I had to select 'Windows Normal Mode' twice before it got to the desktop). Occassionally Adobe programs like Bridge and Illustrator 'stop' working (unexpected error) and this is more of a concern.

Just to add a little more info. Vista gave this clue:

Problem signature:
Problem Event Name: BlueScreen
OS Version: 6.0.6001.2.1.0.768.3
Locale ID: 3081
Additional information about the problem:
BCCode: 116
BCP1: FFFFFA800A0BD2E0
BCP2: FFFFFA600242D4F8
BCP3: 0000000000000000
BCP4: 0000000000000002
OS Version: 6_0_6001
Service Pack: 1_0
Product: 768_1
Files that help describe the problem:
C:\Windows\Minidump\Mini080608-02.dmp
C:\Users\Jack Larm\AppData\Local\Temp\WER-40232-0.sysdata.xml
C:\Users\Jack Larm\AppData\Local\Temp\WER9F0C.tmp.version.txt

----------------

Now, I haven't been able to source the AppData folder and the subsequent XML or TXT files mentioned. The Minidump I found but it means nothing to me, especially because I can't open it or do anything with it. Admittedly, I'm not used to doing more with my machine except using it as a creative tool.

In response to some of your advice. I've had my machine less than a week and I was assured that everything was working well. The only thing the tech-guy mentioned was that my front headphone jack (the one on my tower, i.e. Antec Three Hundred) wasn't accepting the driver he was trying to install. From his experience it was crashing the system. I accepted this as an x64 hiccup and said I could live with it not being fixed.

Do I return my system? I'd rather not because I use it for almost everything I do and as a Graphic Artist I can't really part with it. But if this problem is a serious one and their responsibility, perhaps I shouldn't accept second best.

With regard to installing something new, yes I've been installing stuff but the problem has been there from day one. What I don't understand is how the computer shop gave it over to me as though this wasn't happening to them.

Finally, the other more technical advice I do want to try but I can only proceed cautiously because I've never done anything like that before. BTW, I've only got a dial-up connection because of where I live, so I can only visit the Internet on a once or twice daily basis.

Thank you again for the advice. I'm seriously thinking now that the good money I spent on this system should have come better prepared. I wonder if the computer shop/tech-guy was sloppy or lying or both.

Oskari · Aug 6, 2008

kruger said:
Anyway, I suppose you can just re-image the machine and see if that works. Its definitely possible to have a bad image from the factory. I would be more inclined to run a HHD utility or better yet check all the hardware and make sure everything is OK and the drive isn't bad, then re-image it, just to be sure all is well.

What do you mean by 're-imaging'? And what's an HHD utility? Like I said above, this machine is literally out-of-the-box and I was assured that all up-to-date x64 drivers were installed and working before I picked it up. The only thing I had to check was that my monitor (Samsung 2232BW) was working as they didn't take it our of the box and try it. The monitor works beautifully, but there don't seem to be any x64 drivers for the fancy utilities that come with the monitor.

Oskari · Aug 6, 2008

I'll try not to be a pest, but I really want to learn to solve this problem, especially without returning this system (that should be a last resort, I hope).

I took the plunge and found the System Configuration section of Vista (yeah, I know, this sounds pretty naive...). Anyway, from the Start Up section the list is as follows (I wish there was a way to copy-and-paste this stuff):

Logitech SetPoint
SM56 Helper Windows 32 Utility
Microsoft Windows Operating System
Microsoft Windows Operating System
Acrotray - Adobe Acrobat Distiller Helper Application
Adobe Version Cue CS3
AVG Internet Security
Adobe Acrobat Speed Launcher
Adobe Acrobat Sychronizer
Logitech SetPoint
Microsoft Office XP

NOTE: the multiple entries are not typos on my behalf and point to different folders and/or files.

My suspicion is that there are a few things there that are not essential, i.e. SM56 Helper (this is my dial-up modem) and the Acrobat stuff (as I should only need to use Acrobat on the rare occassion I make PDFs).

I've started to read more and more about this slightly scary CONFIG stuff and understand that I can disable all and then activate each separately until I find the cause of my 'boot loop'. I feel strongly that there is some program or driver that is causing this problem, especially when it has the suffix '32 bit' because I really want to be a 64 bit user. Call me stupid, but I want the advantages of 8Gb+ of RAM.

kruger · Aug 6, 2008

By Re-imaging, I mean to reload the operating system or restoring the unit to original specs. Either using a service partition, restore CD's or DVD's or an OEM, Retail or some other copy of your flavor of Windows.

You mentioned AppData folder......

AppData folder is going to be under Local Disk C:\users\(your profilename)\AppData

That front headphone jack is simply connected to your motherboard with wires, as is the USB and firewire port in front.

So you are getting a blue screen at some point? Based on some information posted, I was under the impression that it was just chkdsk running when you booted. Is it running through chkdsk, then blue screening and then rebooting?

If I had that machine on my bench I would just run a diagnostic utility like Pc-Check, by Eurosoft, or someother utility, to determine if a machine has bad memory, HDD, motherboard, processor and what not. It is a good way to eliminate hardware issues as the problem. Then if everything checked out OK, then you can consentrate on software issues.

If I understand you correctly, the tech who built your system said he thinks the software for the front jack is whats making your system crash. Then he is probably referring to your sound card drivers.

Definitely don't accept second best. You paid for a good machine, you should have a good, reliable machine to do your work. If you cannot do the repairs your self or do not have the time to do them, I would certainly bring in the unit for service to wherever you bought it.

Oskari · Aug 6, 2008

Thanks Kruger, the CHKDSK problem is probably not a traditional 'blue screen' issue, just that it appears during boot-up as white text on a blue screen. Maybe that's the same thing. Like I said, and as it says on my profile, I'm a NEWBIE.

Anyway, I love computers and I have some patience for working this stuff out. I have things to do other than play tech-guy, but I know that this Vista x64 stuff is like swimming in uncharted territory - or am I just being poetic and pretentious. Perhaps. Yeah, most likely.

Forums like this are fantastic and I know that if I solve this 'little' problem I'll be all the better for it. This I say from experience because I grew up with an Apple II+ and I really enjoyed all that pseudo-DOS/machine language hoopala. I've owned about ten computers since then, run into all sorts of problems and, luckily, been able to sort out the problems. I always looked back with satisfaction that I had learned something...

These programs you mention, like PC-Check, are they freeware? Admittedly, I run on a very tight budget and can't afford too many programs outside of CS3, etc. And even they break my budget.

kruger · Aug 6, 2008

I understand.

Chkdsk is not like the evil BSOD.

Pc-Check is not freeware but... (I don't know what the rules here are about posting certain things) If you look for it, you can get it... or at least borrow someone elses disc.

Oskari · Aug 6, 2008

I understand, Kruger. BSOD = Blue Screen Of Death!

BTW, I do have my original Vista Home Premium disc and, as you suggest, I should think about re-installing it. Do you really think it would help? I mean, I was under the impression that everything was working well before I picked up my machine from the shop. I suspect that my problem is some 32 bit driver, as listed above from my Start Up list. What do you reckon?

Also, I really can't find that AppData folder. When I go to User/my name/... all I find are things like 'documents', 'links', etc. Absolutely no AppData. I should do a search, perhaps...

Fumz · Aug 6, 2008

Oskari said:
I'll try not to be a pest, but I really want to learn to solve this problem, especially without returning this system (that should be a last resort, I hope).

I took the plunge and found the System Configuration section of Vista (yeah, I know, this sounds pretty naive...). Anyway, from the Start Up section the list is as follows (I wish there was a way to copy-and-paste this stuff):

Logitech SetPoint
SM56 Helper Windows 32 Utility
Microsoft Windows Operating System
Microsoft Windows Operating System
Acrotray - Adobe Acrobat Distiller Helper Application
Adobe Version Cue CS3
AVG Internet Security
Adobe Acrobat Speed Launcher
Adobe Acrobat Sychronizer
Logitech SetPoint
Microsoft Office XP

NOTE: the multiple entries are not typos on my behalf and point to different folders and/or files.

My suspicion is that there are a few things there that are not essential, i.e. SM56 Helper (this is my dial-up modem) and the Acrobat stuff (as I should only need to use Acrobat on the rare occassion I make PDFs).

I've started to read more and more about this slightly scary CONFIG stuff and understand that I can disable all and then activate each separately until I find the cause of my 'boot loop'. I feel strongly that there is some program or driver that is causing this problem, especially when it has the suffix '32 bit' because I really want to be a 64 bit user. Call me stupid, but I want the advantages of 8Gb+ of RAM.

In msconfig, on the startup tab, disable all that adobe crap and Office. If you use the Logitech software, then keep the Logitech entry, but if you don't, disable that too as the Windows drivers work perfectly fine.

AppData is a hidden file. To view it, go to the Control Panel/Appearance and Personalization/Folder Options and select the View tab. Place a check in 'show hidden files and folders', hit apply, then you'll see AppData.

Oskari · Aug 6, 2008

I'm really lovin' this forum!

Thanks for that Fumz!

I want a system that only loads essential stuff, not the usual 'Microsoft/Adobe - we will conquer the world' kind of stuff. Is it too much to ask for a system that runs well. I mean, I know where Acrobat and Office is when I need to access it. Gee!

OK, so I'll start deactivating this stuff and go from there. I still think I need to have a firm word or two with the shop that sold me this machine! I love it but...

kruger · Aug 6, 2008

Sorry about that... the AppData folder is a hidden folder by default.

When you have Windows Explorer open, go to Tools, Folder Options, View tab and look for Hidden Files and Folders. Chek the button next to Show Hidden files and Folders. Now you will be able to see the AppData folder.

Fumz · Aug 6, 2008

Oskari said:
I'm really lovin' this forum!

Thanks for that Fumz!

I want a system that only loads essential stuff, not the usual 'Microsoft/Adobe - we will conquer the world' kind of stuff. Is it too much to ask for a system that runs well. I mean, I know where Acrobat and Office is when I need to access it. Gee!

OK, so I'll start deactivating this stuff and go from there. I still think I need to have a firm word or two with the shop that sold me this machine! I love it but...

You may find after using Adobe that it reloads itself into msconfig? Not sure, it's been a while since I've used their stuff... I hate apps that do that and use Foxit instead... so you'll have to go into the options page within Adobe and tell it not to load at startup.

Foxit Software reader
Foxit Software creator

Oskari · Aug 6, 2008

Funny thing is...I still can't find the 'files' mentioned in that little applet created by Vista. Yeah, I followed your advice and revealed the hidden AppData folder, but there was no sign of any 'WER' files. Maybe I need a new pair of eyes?

I'm sitting here now, disabled those pesky Adobe and Microsoft 'start ups' and do a restart and my machine does a pure and simple retart, i.e. no funny CHKDSK or 'Windows Normal' stuff. Brilliant! But maybe I'm just counting unhatched eggs. It felt good though...

A sideline issue about my monitor display, if you don't mind because there's no section within this forum for monitors...

Why do my 'standard' lettering have artifacts? You know, the basic letters have sort of a reddish hue about them, especially in MS Word? It's only a little annoying...

Fumz · Aug 6, 2008

Have you tuned your monitor?

Oskari · Aug 6, 2008

Fumz, call me dumb...but what do you mean?

Fumz · Aug 6, 2008

While you made an excellent choice, no monitor is perfect right out of the box. You have to adjust your colors and brightness. If it's too red, then turn red down until it looks right.

Samsung has software that can calibrate the monitor for you, Natural Color and Magic Tune, but for the life of me I can't figure them out? :confused:

Aside from that, I understand that having these apps running can cause games to crash... at least that's what a friend of mine with a 226BW and my Brother-in-Law with a 225BW said... so I avoided them altogether.

I don't have the links handy, but guys have made custom color profiles for Samsung monitors you can find on the net; they're made by über geeks who insist on perfection, and you may want to consider that if manually setting things becomes too tedious?

However, having said all that, since these monitors are pretty good out of the box, you'll probably only have to adjust one or two things and only minimally?

Oskari · Aug 6, 2008

Compared to my old 17" 'blurry-as-hell' CRT, this Samsung is crisp and bright. In fact, I have the brightness down to 40% and it still lights up the room! Just kidding. But it is bright. To be fair, I've only had my new machine less than a week and I haven't had the time or inclination to go over everything - that's why a forum like this is very motivating (but I have to find time to sleep, I guess).

I did try and find those Samsung utilities (Natural Color Pro and Magic Tune) on the Net but came up blank. Samsung's site was no good or it was being updated or the techs all went off to the Olympics. The versions that came on disk were no good as they were 32 bit and failed to run or worse.

Besides that, I think everything comes up a treat. Funny thing is that only certain letters or words have that red-magenta hue, like the number '32' above (there it goes again...I wonder if it's just numbers, ummm, 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,0...or maybe I need to rest my eyes). Yes, it seems especially noticable on the 3's and 2's.

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